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Post by CrispPusher on Jul 22, 2015 16:49:11 GMT
 He most certainly did turn his back to it, but never mind he's happy enough paying thousands of pounds a week to Her Majesty's Treasury  |
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Post by onion on Jul 22, 2015 16:52:38 GMT
He most certainly did turn his back to it, but never mind he's happy enough paying thousands of pounds a week to the Her Majesty's Treasury Oh was the flag over the other side of the pitch was it? See if he turned his back to it, he'd be staring at Lescott. |
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Post by CrispPusher on Jul 22, 2015 16:54:21 GMT
He most certainly did turn his back to it, but never mind he's happy enough paying thousands of pounds a week to the Her Majesty's Treasury Oh was the flag over the other side of the pitch was it? See if he turned his back to it, he'd be staring at Lescott. Good input, well done. |
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Post by onion on Jul 22, 2015 16:58:24 GMT
Oh was the flag over the other side of the pitch was it? See if he turned his back to it, he'd be staring at Lescott. Good input, well done. Phew. Thank you. I'm glad I've the approval of someone who doesn't understand where the human spine is. |
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Post by lulworthgas on Jul 22, 2015 17:18:18 GMT
I am as they use this fools actions as propaganda fuelling the hatred that clearly still exists. The poppy snub was all over sinn feins newspaper and im sure the flag and national anthem will be to. The blokes happy to take the wage and conduct his football in the country he seems to hate so much so will have to live by his actions. Mediocre footballer who has to rely on these stunts to massage his own ego no doubt. Scum in my opinion. Right so McClean doesn't want to dishonour the memory of people who were not IRA members who were massacred. And now you say that newspapers sympathetic to a political party with seats in the House of Commons (albeit they do not take those seats but they are recognised by parliament) who have campaigned for the recognition of the same massacred innocent people who were not members of the IRA have supported McClean's stance. Sorry ... where do the IRA come into it again? So by that logic do the england players dishonour british people killed by respecting the flag and anthem of the team they are playing such as Germany and Ireland. Also you are a respected poster, you yourself know that sinn fein has party members that were high profile members of the IRA. There were innocent people killed on both sides including children blown up on the British main land. These acts were unforgivable but there only seems to be one side that is willing to move on and leave the past in the past. As I said, this behaviour will influence kids growing up in Northern Ireland and add to the fuel of the sinn Fein/ IRA propaganda machine. Lets not forget that SF activley backed a violent war against every British person in order to break up the UK and return a province to Irish rule where the majority of the population see themselves as British. Id like to think you are playing devils advocate as I respect your posts,but to back someone who is clearly going out of his way to upset the very people that pay his wage, makes me question that respect. UTG |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Jul 22, 2015 17:27:54 GMT
Well, if a national symbol is so fragile everyone goes into fits coz some bloke shuffles around a bit for a moment then you have to question its value.
This reminds me of people who get upset coz you've disrespected their god by not wearing the right hat, or having a certain meal at the wrong time.
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Post by lulworthgas on Jul 22, 2015 17:39:06 GMT
Well, if a national symbol is so fragile everyone goes into fits coz some bloke shuffles around a bit for a moment then you have to question its value. This reminds me of people who get upset coz you've disrespected their god by not wearing the right hat, or having a certain meal at the wrong time. Not so much the flag incident but when you add it to the poppy incident to you can see why people would get annoyed that he can earn a very good living here whilst taking the mick out of our traditions. I wouldnt go to Ireland and disrespect their symbols to their fallen. If i did id probably be knee capped at best, stuck in a boot and murdered at worst. |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Jul 22, 2015 17:50:06 GMT
Well, if a national symbol is so fragile everyone goes into fits coz some bloke shuffles around a bit for a moment then you have to question its value. This reminds me of people who get upset coz you've disrespected their god by not wearing the right hat, or having a certain meal at the wrong time. Not so much the flag incident but when you add it to the poppy incident to you can see why people would get annoyed that he can earn a very good living here whilst taking the mick out of our traditions. I wouldnt go to Ireland and disrespect their symbols to their fallen. If i did id probably be knee capped at best, stuck in a boot and murdered at worst. If you went to the wrong area and did that, you might. But then if JM went to the wrong area he wouldn't last very long, either. Fortunately, most of us live in a better place than that. A more tolerant place. Although some people do try to drag it down. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Jul 22, 2015 17:51:32 GMT
This is the problem when politics and sport get muddled, no country, race, nation, religion is squeaky clean enough to be able to point the finger with out a couple pointing back at them. Personally I am not offended by his actions, he isnt english so he doesnt have to stand there like a soldier and sing.
I may be in the minority but Im not one to fall over myself singing the national anthem or drapsing myself in a union jack. I am happy to stand there and observe, maybe that would offend some people, either way, thats my right to decide as it is others to stand there heart crossed and lungs straining.
I remember Eddie Irvine being the subject of a similar controversy in F1 when he asked for a certain type of politcally neutral flag rather than the union jack, Irish or Northern Irish flag. His opinion was, Im from Ireland, just happens to be in the North, but I dont want the political grief and a union flag is a bit non descript for me as I have no ties to the UK. Fair point.
Storm in a teacup IMO..
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Post by philbemmygas on Jul 22, 2015 17:57:43 GMT
Lulworth Gas is a proud member of the same group that I belong to, we have friends and colleagues that will always remain affected by the actions of the IRA, we appreciate that others have opinions on this matter. But please don't try to tar us with the same brush as those callous killers who used both the bomb and the bullet to enforce their message in mainland Europe as well as the UK.
I will say no more on the subject as you are all entitled to an opinion, but if you haven't experienced the grief personally you are unlikely to understand me.
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Post by LJG on Jul 22, 2015 18:37:00 GMT
Lulworth Gas is a proud member of the same group that I belong to, we have friends and colleagues that will always remain affected by the actions of the IRA, we appreciate that others have opinions on this matter. But please don't try to tar us with the same brush as those callous killers who used both the bomb and the bullet to enforce their message in mainland Europe as well as the UK. I will say no more on the subject as you are all entitled to an opinion, but if you haven't experienced the grief personally you are unlikely to understand me. It's funny how you talk about being tarred with the same brush. As I've said before DM is respecting the Bloody Sunday victims. They were innocent people. Because they were from N.I. you've tarred them as IRA affiliates. Works both ways doesn't it? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 18:40:23 GMT
Lulworth Gas is a proud member of the same group that I belong to, we have friends and colleagues that will always remain affected by the actions of the IRA, we appreciate that others have opinions on this matter. But please don't try to tar us with the same brush as those callous killers who used both the bomb and the bullet to enforce their message in mainland Europe as well as the UK. I will say no more on the subject as you are all entitled to an opinion, but if you haven't experienced the grief personally you are unlikely to understand me. Are the families of those murdered by the British Army on Bloody Sunday allowed an opinion Phil? Blinkered. |
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Post by LJG on Jul 22, 2015 18:50:38 GMT
Right so McClean doesn't want to dishonour the memory of people who were not IRA members who were massacred. And now you say that newspapers sympathetic to a political party with seats in the House of Commons (albeit they do not take those seats but they are recognised by parliament) who have campaigned for the recognition of the same massacred innocent people who were not members of the IRA have supported McClean's stance. Sorry ... where do the IRA come into it again? So by that logic do the england players dishonour british people killed by respecting the flag and anthem of the team they are playing such as Germany and Ireland. Also you are a respected poster, you yourself know that sinn fein has party members that were high profile members of the IRA. There were innocent people killed on both sides including children blown up on the British main land. These acts were unforgivable but there only seems to be one side that is willing to move on and leave the past in the past. As I said, this behaviour will influence kids growing up in Northern Ireland and add to the fuel of the sinn Fein/ IRA propaganda machine. Lets not forget that SF activley backed a violent war against every British person in order to break up the UK and return a province to Irish rule where the majority of the population see themselves as British. Id like to think you are playing devils advocate as I respect your posts,but to back someone who is clearly going out of his way to upset the very people that pay his wage, makes me question that respect. UTG I think you're missing avital point that is ... not everyone in the world is English so they don't have to honour any sort of English tradition. England players on the other hand are English so it's expected of them to do so. Sinn Fein leaders as IRA members - there's no definite answer. Some strong circumstantial and anecdotal evidence fine. Ian Paisley was an open advocate of the UVF, they bombed and gunned just as much. There are plenty of responses to the "lets not forget ... ". Let's not forget lots of things. Let's not forget innocent people and not IRA members were shot and killed on Bloody Sunday. So instead of conflating those innocent people with the IRA let's not forget that there is no obligation on anyone to conform to English nationalist traditions, not even English nationals but least of all someone who is not an English national. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 19:21:10 GMT
I take a modicum of displeasure with your remark about the British Army. Some of the provocation that I and others who served over there were subjected to deserve to be taken into account before you throw a comment like that over the wall. I think provocation is putting it lightly Phil . . . Really? I think if I, or my family, had been in Croke Park on that fateful day of mass murder I would be very provoked. I am anyway, for the record. How apt that the so called Royal Family were giving Nazi Salutes a decade or so later. By the Left (no thinking in the ranks) |
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Post by 4evergas67 on Jul 22, 2015 19:21:15 GMT
At Wembley when Ellis ran over to the corner with a few others to celebrate right in front of where I was sitting,
Someone threw a St Georges flag at him with BRFC on it he caught it took a quick look and threw it back.
He's Welsh so I can understand why would not want to drape him self in another countries flag.
But I would not expect him to turn his back on an anthem or a flag of a country that he quite happily plies he trade in.
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Post by 4evergas67 on Jul 22, 2015 19:22:43 GMT
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Post by Snoop Dogg on Jul 22, 2015 19:41:09 GMT
At Wembley when Ellis ran over to the corner with a few others to celebrate right in front of where I was sitting, Someone threw a St Georges flag at him with BRFC on it he caught it took a quick look and threw it back. He's Welsh so I can understand why would not want to drape him self in another countries flag. But I would not expect him to turn his back on an anthem or a flag of a country that he quite happily plies he trade in. Good on him. The St.Georges cross has no place on a Rovers flag. |
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Post by philbemmygas on Jul 22, 2015 20:11:50 GMT
Lulworth Gas is a proud member of the same group that I belong to, we have friends and colleagues that will always remain affected by the actions of the IRA, we appreciate that others have opinions on this matter. But please don't try to tar us with the same brush as those callous killers who used both the bomb and the bullet to enforce their message in mainland Europe as well as the UK. I will say no more on the subject as you are all entitled to an opinion, but if you haven't experienced the grief personally you are unlikely to understand me. Are the families of those murdered by the British Army on Bloody Sunday allowed an opinion Phil? Blinkered. I actually said I would not comment further on this, but I will add one last comment.
They are allowed an opinion and I can not stop them expressing it. Next home game come and chat to me about my good mate Clive who was hundreds of miles away when the a**hole stepped out of a bush and emptied a magazine into the car his wife Heidi was driving. Then maybe you will understand why I have an opinion on it.
For the record I am not blinkered I am aware it is two-sided, but I lived through years of constant threat to my family and friends and that is my way.
I have southern Irish blood on my fathers side & he hates the way that things developed over the years.
Up the Gas
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Post by 4evergas67 on Jul 22, 2015 20:29:46 GMT
At Wembley when Ellis ran over to the corner with a few others to celebrate right in front of where I was sitting, Someone threw a St Georges flag at him with BRFC on it he caught it took a quick look and threw it back. He's Welsh so I can understand why would not want to drape him self in another countries flag. But I would not expect him to turn his back on an anthem or a flag of a country that he quite happily plies he trade in. Good on him. The St.Georges cross has no place on a Rovers flag. Or an inbred six fingered child molester city flag flag? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 21:06:22 GMT
Are the families of those murdered by the British Army on Bloody Sunday allowed an opinion Phil? Blinkered. I actually said I would not comment further on this, but I will add one last comment.
They are allowed an opinion and I can not stop them expressing it. Next home game come and chat to me about my good mate Clive who was hundreds of miles away when the a**hole stepped out of a bush and emptied a magazine into the car his wife Heidi was driving. Then maybe you will understand why I have an opinion on it.
For the record I am not blinkered I am aware it is two-sided, but I lived through years of constant threat to my family and friends and that is my way.
I have southern Irish blood on my fathers side & he hates the way that things developed over the years.
Up the Gas
It's just amazing to me how you can have these intimate feelings of loss and rage but no comprehension of how someone on the other side of the fight wouldn't feel exactly the same emotions you're describing. That's why humans will never learn I suppose. |
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