Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2020 22:09:22 GMT
Yes but he played the game Arrigo Sacchi, Arsene Wenger and Jose Mourinho didn't play the game professionally, neither did Brendan Rodgers. This fallacy that you must have "Played the game" to be a manager is nonsense. Will BG succeed? Who knows, probably not here. Yes!!, shout out the 300 million non footballers that didn’t make it as footballers or managers!!! |
|
|
|
Post by bluebiro on Sept 8, 2020 22:14:05 GMT
I never played the game professionally but one thing I do know. The guy is way out of his depth
|
|
|
|
Post by landrover on Sept 8, 2020 22:15:16 GMT
Well this is the opposite of GC. Don't forget GC made it look better than it was for DC by being the defensive coach. When he took over the job was done, stop the goals from going in, play ugly and avoid relegation. Build from the back. Ben is either brave or foolish, he is hell bent on playing his type of football, but if his type of football let's in five goals in two games, one of those teams in a lower league than us, I can't see it working, as much as I want it to. Teams can win competitions by scoring very few goals, but they can't win by leaking them. Compared to GC it all seems very inexperienced and naive to me. Will Sunderland be playing another academy side on Saturday with a similar result, that's my worry. The irony in all this is that Garner’s coaching history is with manager’s that played fairly basic football. Pulis, Pardew, Warnock, Coppell and Holloway aren’t exactly Pep clones are they. Assuming that possession based football has always been Garner’s true intention, then his career has been one big lie. But then I’ve always thought him to be a fraud. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2020 22:16:51 GMT
Yes but he played the game Arrigo Sacchi, Arsene Wenger and Jose Mourinho didn't play the game professionally, neither did Brendan Rodgers. This fallacy that you must have "Played the game" to be a manager is nonsense. Will BG succeed? Who knows, probably not here. Yeah that’s a fair point, but on the flip side of that as Gas-Ed pointed out- how many managers can you think of who turned around form that Garner is in and went on to be a success? It’s fair, imo, to say it’s not normal. Only truly inept managers go on a run like this. You would think there should be an upward curve in the form as Garner got to grips with things, but there are just two wins. We surely should be seeing some sort of improvement by now in terms of wins to show he is learning. Or at least an improvement in performance, but so far, two competitive games in with his own players we aren’t even seeing the shoots of a rebirth. It all seems like last season. Aimless passing, water poor defending and a failure to react to in-game situations where an opponent has found a weakness they can repeatedly exploit. |
|
|
|
Post by daniel300380 on Sept 8, 2020 23:01:17 GMT
Didn't watch tonight's game as it's the trophy, plus it's my wedding anniversary. Just had a look through the last few pages. Thought we must have put out our strongest side after seeing most of the comments. Then checked to see we rested a lot of the player's that should be key this season. Ehmer, Westbrook, Nicholson didn't feature at all. Grant and JLM were on the bench and obviously Anssi was on international duty. Trying a centre back in midfield with a youth player making his debut.
Suprised anyone actually cares and paid £10 when most people boycott the games anyway.
Roll on Saturday. That's when it actually matters. With no striker I'm surprised Sunderland are only 4/5. Some of you on here should put you live savings on at those odds, after all we have lost the first 3 league games already.
|
|
|
|
Post by Gastafari on Sept 8, 2020 23:06:51 GMT
Arrigo Sacchi, Arsene Wenger and Jose Mourinho didn't play the game professionally, neither did Brendan Rodgers. This fallacy that you must have "Played the game" to be a manager is nonsense. Will BG succeed? Who knows, probably not here. Yeah that’s a fair point, but on the flip side of that as Gas-Ed pointed out- how many managers can you think of who turned around form that Garner is in and went on to be a success? It’s fair, imo, to say it’s not normal. Only truly inept managers go on a run like this. You would think there should be an upward curve in the form as Garner got to grips with things, but there are just two wins. We surely should be seeing some sort of improvement by now in terms of wins to show he is learning. Or at least an improvement in performance, but so far, two competitive games in with his own players we aren’t even seeing the shoots of a rebirth. It all seems like last season. Aimless passing, water poor defending and a failure to react to in-game situations where an opponent has found a weakness they can repeatedly exploit. I've used Brendan Rodgers as an example a few times. He failed at his first 2 jobs getting sacked from both of them within 6 months. Maybe a case of wrong place, wrong time. He then went to Swansea and it all kicked into place. Since then he's managed Liverpool, Celtic and now Leicester at the top echelons of the Premier League. BG's route into coaching and now management is very similar. Will BG emulate or get anywhere near that level? Who knows. |
|
|
|
Post by gasandelectricity on Sept 8, 2020 23:15:59 GMT
Yeah that’s a fair point, but on the flip side of that as Gas-Ed pointed out- how many managers can you think of who turned around form that Garner is in and went on to be a success? It’s fair, imo, to say it’s not normal. Only truly inept managers go on a run like this. You would think there should be an upward curve in the form as Garner got to grips with things, but there are just two wins. We surely should be seeing some sort of improvement by now in terms of wins to show he is learning. Or at least an improvement in performance, but so far, two competitive games in with his own players we aren’t even seeing the shoots of a rebirth. It all seems like last season. Aimless passing, water poor defending and a failure to react to in-game situations where an opponent has found a weakness they can repeatedly exploit. I've used Brendan Rodgers as an example a few times. He failed at his first 2 jobs getting sacked from both of them within 6 months. Maybe a case of wrong place, wrong time. He then went to Swansea and it all kicked into place. Since then he's managed Liverpool, Celtic and now Leicester at the top echelons of the Premier League. BG's route into coaching and now management is very similar. Will BG emulate or get anywhere near that level? Who knows. Brendan Rodgers at Watford: 41.9% win rate Reading: 26.1%. BG makes the reading win rate look like a whopper. If things continue as they are with BG no team will give him a chance again other than as a caretaker after acting as assistant to a since dismissed manager. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2020 2:17:19 GMT
I've used Brendan Rodgers as an example a few times. He failed at his first 2 jobs getting sacked from both of them within 6 months. Maybe a case of wrong place, wrong time. He then went to Swansea and it all kicked into place. Since then he's managed Liverpool, Celtic and now Leicester at the top echelons of the Premier League. BG's route into coaching and now management is very similar. Will BG emulate or get anywhere near that level? Who knows. Brendan Rodgers at Watford: 41.9% win rate Reading: 26.1%. BG makes the reading win rate look like a whopper. If things continue as they are with BG no team will give him a chance again other than as a caretaker after acting as assistant to a since dismissed manager. There aren’t many chairmen, if any, who would still have kept him on for this season with only two wins from 20 or whatever it is. Statistically one of the worst managerial records the football league has *ever* seen. Let that sink in for a moment. And yet....we’re all assholes for not being optimistic? 😂 |
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Sept 9, 2020 3:26:07 GMT
Didn't watch tonight's game as it's the trophy, plus it's my wedding anniversary. Just had a look through the last few pages. Thought we must have put out our strongest side after seeing most of the comments. Then checked to see we rested a lot of the player's that should be key this season. Ehmer, Westbrook, Nicholson didn't feature at all. Grant and JLM were on the bench and obviously Anssi was on international duty. Trying a centre back in midfield with a youth player making his debut. Suprised anyone actually cares and paid £10 when most people boycott the games anyway. Roll on Saturday. That's when it actually matters. With no striker I'm surprised Sunderland are only 4/5. Some of you on here should put you live savings on at those odds, after all we have lost the first 3 league games already. I know you meant it tongue in cheek but never advise anyone to put their life savings on a bet. There are some who will read that and bet more than they can afford. Only bet what you can afford to lose although I do agree at 4/5 it is good value, I would expect it to shorten nearer kick off. |
|
|
|
Post by romangas on Sept 9, 2020 4:30:02 GMT
|
|
pirate
Forum Legend
Posts: 19,471 
|
Post by pirate on Sept 9, 2020 4:37:20 GMT
Rickie Lambert: "he was a very expansive coach, who focused on attacking and playing football on the deck. He was very organized, but imaginative, and had a great understanding of players. He’s a real modern coach." He said: "Ben's a very nice fella. Everyone liked him." |
|
|
|
Post by Qatar Gas on Sept 9, 2020 4:46:39 GMT
Fairly anonymous tbh. Disappointing. That's a shame, but he's only 18 I believe. I think he's got a bright future. Mehew was by far the best youngster out there. Walker did very little, but it was only one game. He will get more opportunities. |
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Sept 9, 2020 5:44:35 GMT
I don't think a manager should lose his job on results alone but when the staff and players have lost confidence in him. If this hasn't happened I would continue with him at least for the near future.
Wael has made a big investment in him a whole new squad and completely different style of play to the previous manager. If confidence is still there inside the club I would bite the bullet. On paper it looks like we will be thrashed on Sat but we can only lose three points the same as if we lost 1-0. Another reason for staying with it is stability. An appointment of a manager is the hardest position to fill successfully. The Liverpool's, Chelsea's, Man City and United have all made the wrong choices. So it's not as though there is a perfect successor waiting around the corner.
Garner is going to make huge mistakes because he's inexperienced. Holloway did the same before he learnt the hard way and took Blackpool to the Prem and no one wanted to succeed at Rovers more than him. It's frustrating for us because although we may not have a coaching badge between us we have seen it all before and mistakes that other managers have made. On the positive side I think we have two first teams with almost every player having a high degree of technical ability. I thought his subs last night were very good and signs that Ayunga, Daly and ML could be an effective strike force. So imho stick with it until he's lost the confidence of the staff and players and take defeats on the chin. A replacement doesn't come with a guarantee.
|
|
|
|
Post by Gas Go Marching In on Sept 9, 2020 5:53:35 GMT
I don't think a manager should lose his job on results alone but when the staff and players have lost confidence in him. If this hasn't happened I would continue with him at least for the near future. Wael has made a big investment in him a whole new squad and completely different style of play to the previous manager. If confidence is still there inside the club I would bite the bullet. On paper it looks like we will be thrashed on Sat but we can only lose three points the same as if we lost 1-0. Another reason for staying with it is stability. An appointment of a manager is the hardest position to fill successfully. The Liverpool's, Chelsea's, Man City and United have all made the wrong choices. So it's not as though there is a perfect successor waiting around the corner. Garner is going to make huge mistakes because he's inexperienced. Holloway did the same before he learnt the hard way and took Blackpool to the Prem and no one wanted to succeed at Rovers more than him. It's frustrating for us because although we may not have a coaching badge between us we have seen it all before and mistakes that other managers have made. On the positive side I think we have two first teams with almost every player having a high degree of technical ability. I thought his subs last night were very good and signs that Ayunga, Daly and ML could be an effective strike force. So imho stick with it until he's lost the confidence of the staff and players and take defeats on the chin. A replacement doesn't come with a guarantee.But I would argue that keep him does come with a guarantee. |
|
|
|
Post by bluebiro on Sept 9, 2020 6:40:14 GMT
Dont buy this inexperience excuse. It's not as if he just stopped playing and became a manager. Majority of his working life has been on the coaching or assistant side. Of course players like good old ben makes the coaching fun by moving the cones around so they look good.
But he is not and never will be a manager of a successful lower league team.
|
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Sept 9, 2020 6:40:53 GMT
I don't think a manager should lose his job on results alone but when the staff and players have lost confidence in him. If this hasn't happened I would continue with him at least for the near future. Wael has made a big investment in him a whole new squad and completely different style of play to the previous manager. If confidence is still there inside the club I would bite the bullet. On paper it looks like we will be thrashed on Sat but we can only lose three points the same as if we lost 1-0. Another reason for staying with it is stability. An appointment of a manager is the hardest position to fill successfully. The Liverpool's, Chelsea's, Man City and United have all made the wrong choices. So it's not as though there is a perfect successor waiting around the corner. Garner is going to make huge mistakes because he's inexperienced. Holloway did the same before he learnt the hard way and took Blackpool to the Prem and no one wanted to succeed at Rovers more than him. It's frustrating for us because although we may not have a coaching badge between us we have seen it all before and mistakes that other managers have made. On the positive side I think we have two first teams with almost every player having a high degree of technical ability. I thought his subs last night were very good and signs that Ayunga, Daly and ML could be an effective strike force. So imho stick with it until he's lost the confidence of the staff and players and take defeats on the chin. A replacement doesn't come with a guarantee.But I would argue that keep him does come with a guarantee. |
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Sept 9, 2020 6:44:12 GMT
But I would argue that keep him does come with a guarantee. I know what you mean but in reality nothing is certain imho. |
|
|
|
Post by Gas Go Marching In on Sept 9, 2020 6:49:12 GMT
I know what you mean but in reality nothing is certain imho. I think we'll certainly be in a relegation battle with BG in charge. At best. And my worry is I'm not convinced we'll have enough battle. |
|
|
|
Post by neogas on Sept 9, 2020 6:56:51 GMT
I have just watched the highlights on YouTube and I am concerned about the similarity and common factor in both goals. For the first goal Baldwin does not show enough aggression and desire to disrupt the player attacking the ball allowing a free header. For the second goal Tutonda comes out to challenge the crosser but slows down before getting there allowing a free cross and again it didn’t look like the aggression and desire to stop the cross was there. It raises some questions for me:
1) Are we fit enough - I thought we tired after 35mins in both halves?
2) Is the focus on playing style and good football at the expense of grit, determination and desire?
3) Are we earning the right to play the football Ben wants?
|
|
|
|
Post by Congas on Sept 9, 2020 6:56:54 GMT
Isn’t this the competition that most people usually say ‘play the kids’ or ‘experiment with formations/tactics’ and ‘give him a run out to get some minutes’, oh and the classic ‘i hope we lose so we are knocked out of this tin pot cup’? Cant have it both ways just to suit your agenda. 'Play the kids' or 'experiment with formations/tactics' and 'give him a run out to get some minutes' is exactly what the group stage of this competition is about. How many on here have actually watched any matches before? Can't be many judging by the crowds since the fans' boycott began, but now it's on iFollow for all to see, people are up in arms at the standard of play. Well, having watched this trophy since iFollow first started, I'll tell you that was one of the better games as far as movement and urgency is concerned. You'd have all been suicidal after the Stevenage game last season against a side rock bottom of the football league that looked more 10th tier than National League. We can't judge anything until at least ten games into the season. |
|
