pirate
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Post by pirate on Jul 16, 2021 10:14:39 GMT
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Aug 15, 2021 14:01:27 GMT
Well Biden & Johnson have royally screwed up with Afghanistan. 20 yrs totally wasted , just to let the Taliban and Al Qaeda run the show and no doubt export their warped ideologies.
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Post by trevorgas on Aug 15, 2021 14:16:14 GMT
Well Biden & Johnson have royally screwed up with Afghanistan. 20 yrs totally wasted , just to let the Taliban and Al Qaeda run the show and no doubt export their warped ideologies. 👏 There was no way that we could stay in Afghanistan once Biden had announced the US were leaving,this is entirely at Bidens door. If you look at the history of Afghanistan over the past 400 years no one has managed to subdue the Country indeed,we have tried on 3 previous occasions and have had to leave ignominiously. I said to my other half 20 years ago this would be the outcome and sadly it is. What the answer is I have no idea but boots on the ground are never going to be successful the same as it never was in Vietnam,we should have learnt by now that Insurgencies are impossible to defeat |
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Aug 15, 2021 14:25:56 GMT
Well Biden & Johnson have royally screwed up with Afghanistan. 20 yrs totally wasted , just to let the Taliban and Al Qaeda run the show and no doubt export their warped ideologies. 👏 There was no way that we could stay in Afghanistan once Biden had announced the US were leaving,this is entirely at Bidens door. If you look at the history of Afghanistan over the past 400 years no one has managed to subdue the Country indeed,we have tried on 3 previous occasions and have had to leave ignominiously. I said to my other half 20 years ago this would be the outcome and sadly it is. What the answer is I have no idea but boots on the ground are never going to be successful the same as it never was in Vietnam,we should have learnt by now that Insurgencies are impossible to defeat I’m not all across this but didn’t Trump say he was going to pull out all the troops as well? Agreed that Biden has totally messed up big time . Pulling out so quickly was always going to be a disaster |
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Post by oldie on Aug 15, 2021 14:34:11 GMT
There was no way that we could stay in Afghanistan once Biden had announced the US were leaving,this is entirely at Bidens door. If you look at the history of Afghanistan over the past 400 years no one has managed to subdue the Country indeed,we have tried on 3 previous occasions and have had to leave ignominiously. I said to my other half 20 years ago this would be the outcome and sadly it is. What the answer is I have no idea but boots on the ground are never going to be successful the same as it never was in Vietnam,we should have learnt by now that Insurgencies are impossible to defeat I’m not all across this but didn’t Trump say he was going to pull out all the troops as well? Agreed that Biden has totally messed up big time . Pulling out so quickly was always going to be a disaster Why were we there in the first place? |
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Post by stuart1974 on Aug 15, 2021 15:55:35 GMT
Well Biden & Johnson have royally screwed up with Afghanistan. 20 yrs totally wasted , just to let the Taliban and Al Qaeda run the show and no doubt export their warped ideologies. 👏 There was no way that we could stay in Afghanistan once Biden had announced the US were leaving,this is entirely at Bidens door. If you look at the history of Afghanistan over the past 400 years no one has managed to subdue the Country indeed,we have tried on 3 previous occasions and have had to leave ignominiously. I said to my other half 20 years ago this would be the outcome and sadly it is. What the answer is I have no idea but boots on the ground are never going to be successful the same as it never was in Vietnam,we should have learnt by now that Insurgencies are impossible to defeat We lost the First Anglo Afghan war but the other two were successful, I agree that we had little option but leave with the US. What happens with insurgencies is that forces are used to mitigate the insurgency until its leaders come to the negotiation table. The first mistake was not bringing the Taliban into negotiations in the early days, another was then kicking hornet's nests when the coalition entered the more rural areas in the south, Helmand and Khandahar being the most obvious conflict areas. |
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Post by trevorgas on Aug 15, 2021 16:56:39 GMT
There was no way that we could stay in Afghanistan once Biden had announced the US were leaving,this is entirely at Bidens door. If you look at the history of Afghanistan over the past 400 years no one has managed to subdue the Country indeed,we have tried on 3 previous occasions and have had to leave ignominiously. I said to my other half 20 years ago this would be the outcome and sadly it is. What the answer is I have no idea but boots on the ground are never going to be successful the same as it never was in Vietnam,we should have learnt by now that Insurgencies are impossible to defeat I’m not all across this but didn’t Trump say he was going to pull out all the troops as well? Agreed that Biden has totally messed up big time . Pulling out so quickly was always going to be a disaster Yep Biden just carried through Trump's decision and that left the British high and dry. |
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Post by trevorgas on Aug 15, 2021 17:03:24 GMT
There was no way that we could stay in Afghanistan once Biden had announced the US were leaving,this is entirely at Bidens door. If you look at the history of Afghanistan over the past 400 years no one has managed to subdue the Country indeed,we have tried on 3 previous occasions and have had to leave ignominiously. I said to my other half 20 years ago this would be the outcome and sadly it is. What the answer is I have no idea but boots on the ground are never going to be successful the same as it never was in Vietnam,we should have learnt by now that Insurgencies are impossible to defeat We lost the First Anglo Afghan war but the other two were successful, I agree that we had little option but leave with the US. What happens with insurgencies is that forces are used to mitigate the insurgency until its leaders come to the negotiation table. The first mistake was not bringing the Taliban into negotiations in the early days, another was then kicking hornet's nests when the coalition entered the more rural areas in the south, Helmand and Khandahar being the most obvious conflict areas. Agree Stuart my point not well articulated was that although we won 2 Wars it did not result in long term change and success. Even if we had succeeded in bringing the Taliban into negotiations history tells us that once we withdrew as we would have had to then they would revert to type. Extremists never compromise their basic beliefs they just set them aside for short term gain. |
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Post by oldie on Aug 15, 2021 17:18:05 GMT
I do wonder under what right do we determine who and what can be defined as "extremist"
Are the Wahabbis in Saudi extreme? You bet ya.
Is Israeli apartheid practice extreme? I would say so. Is China an extreme dictatorship, yep.
All this hand wringing over the Taliban does make me smile.
The Americans decided they dont like Iran, they block vital medical imports, block most forms of financial transactions.
I know the south of Iran is suffering a terrible drought, people are dying of covid by tge 1000s and food price inflation is causing suffering.
Have we inflicted "terror" on the people of Iran?
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Post by stuart1974 on Aug 15, 2021 17:56:48 GMT
We lost the First Anglo Afghan war but the other two were successful, I agree that we had little option but leave with the US. What happens with insurgencies is that forces are used to mitigate the insurgency until its leaders come to the negotiation table. The first mistake was not bringing the Taliban into negotiations in the early days, another was then kicking hornet's nests when the coalition entered the more rural areas in the south, Helmand and Khandahar being the most obvious conflict areas. Agree Stuart my point not well articulated was that although we won 2 Wars it did not result in long term change and success. Even if we had succeeded in bringing the Taliban into negotiations history tells us that once we withdrew as we would have had to then they would revert to type. Extremists never compromise their basic beliefs they just set them aside for short term gain. Our interest in Afghanistan at the time was only to act as a buffer state and prevent the Russian Empire attacking India, to that extent it worked. We 'just' needed a compliant leader to ensure he didn't invite Russia in. Agree about the extremists, they are unreconcilable, the trick with a successful counter insurgency campaign is to remove their reasons to exist, reduce their influence to allow the local security forces to contain them and undermine their support in the local populations. Essentially you have to bring moderate or pragmatic elements to the negotiating table with a genuine opportunity to influence events. |
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Post by axegas on Aug 15, 2021 18:29:03 GMT
Agree Stuart my point not well articulated was that although we won 2 Wars it did not result in long term change and success. Even if we had succeeded in bringing the Taliban into negotiations history tells us that once we withdrew as we would have had to then they would revert to type. Extremists never compromise their basic beliefs they just set them aside for short term gain. Our interest in Afghanistan at the time was only to act as a buffer state and prevent the Russian Empire attacking India, to that extent it worked. We 'just' needed a compliant leader to ensure he didn't invite Russia in. Agree about the extremists, they are unreconcilable, the trick with a successful counter insurgency campaign is to remove their reasons to exist, reduce their influence to allow the local security forces to contain them and undermine their support in the local populations. Essentially you have to bring moderate or pragmatic elements to the negotiating table with a genuine opportunity to influence events. Which is the reason for Afghanistan’s weird looking pan handle and it’s modern day border with China. We didn’t want the Raj to border the Russian empire so we just drew some squiggly lines on the map to prevent it. |
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Post by trevorgas on Aug 15, 2021 19:00:59 GMT
I do wonder under what right do we determine who and what can be defined as "extremist" Are the Wahabbis in Saudi extreme? You bet ya. Is Israeli apartheid practice extreme? I would say so. Is China an extreme dictatorship, yep. All this hand wringing over the Taliban does make me smile. The Americans decided they dont like Iran, they block vital medical imports, block most forms of financial transactions. I know the south of Iran is suffering a terrible drought, people are dying of covid by tge 1000s and food price inflation is causing suffering. Have we inflicted "terror" on the people of Iran? You make an interesting point Les,I think the only defining difference between those regimes you mention and the Taliban is that no matter how repugnant we can negotiate and compromise with the Saudis, China and Israel however that is not possible with the Taliban it's their way or not at all. |
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Post by baggins on Aug 28, 2021 11:31:30 GMT
Dylan Roof, the nutter who wandered into a church known for Black attendees and let loose with automatic pistols back in 2015 has had his death sentence appeal rejected.
This came on a Facebook feed and every single post from Americans was in favour of just killing him. Funnily enough, the majority of reasons is to save tax dollars.
Torn on this one. Death? Life in a cell?
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Post by stuart1974 on Aug 28, 2021 12:12:22 GMT
Dylan Roof, the nutter who wandered into a church known for Black attendees and let loose with automatic pistols back in 2015 has had his death sentence appeal rejected. This came on a Facebook feed and every single post from Americans was in favour of just killing him. Funnily enough, the majority of reasons is to save tax dollars. Torn on this one. Death? Life in a cell? Easy one for me, life in a cell. Not a supporter of capital punishment. |
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Post by baggins on Aug 28, 2021 12:16:40 GMT
Dylan Roof, the nutter who wandered into a church known for Black attendees and let loose with automatic pistols back in 2015 has had his death sentence appeal rejected. This came on a Facebook feed and every single post from Americans was in favour of just killing him. Funnily enough, the majority of reasons is to save tax dollars. Torn on this one. Death? Life in a cell? Easy one for me, life in a cell. Not a supporter of capital punishment. I said the same, but the Yanks want to save tax payers money and kill him. Immediately. |
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Post by oldie on Aug 28, 2021 12:32:48 GMT
Dylan Roof, the nutter who wandered into a church known for Black attendees and let loose with automatic pistols back in 2015 has had his death sentence appeal rejected. This came on a Facebook feed and every single post from Americans was in favour of just killing him. Funnily enough, the majority of reasons is to save tax dollars. Torn on this one. Death? Life in a cell? Easy one for me, life in a cell. Not a supporter of capital punishment. Absolutely Stuart The State killing of prisoners in an act of retribution is disgusting. |
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Post by stuart1974 on Sept 15, 2021 11:30:58 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2021 12:34:21 GMT
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Post by stuart1974 on Sept 16, 2021 12:36:14 GMT
Anything to annoy the French is a good thing. 😉 |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2021 13:05:44 GMT
Anything to annoy the French is a good thing. 😉 new patriotic anthem replacing 10 german bombers - french subs in the bin |
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